My god this quote is awesome.
76 27-12-2007 19:16:48
Re: Entrevista a Y. Wada (Marvelous Interactive). (2 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)
77 18-12-2007 11:11:51
Re: 'Senko no Ronde 2'. (22 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)
78 17-12-2007 14:58:40
Re: Doraemon: Nobita to Midori no Kyojinden DS. (7 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)
Can someone explain to me what you mean by "tax exemption" (franquicia)? I've seen this term in several threads now...
80 16-12-2007 03:47:50
Re: Summon Night 1 y 2, portátiles. (11 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)
Recap escribió:
Nada. Éstos son "simulation RPG" (quise decir "juegos de tácticas", no se nos enfade Icycalm...).
XD
81 05-12-2007 00:34:37
Re: The transliteration thread (44 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)
On a kind-of related note, you should not use exclamation marks in your URLs, because if you try linking those pages in some forums the links won't work. (For example the Dragon Egg! review).
82 04-12-2007 15:44:36
Re: The transliteration thread (44 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)
I am almost convinced!
But damn! Mamo-Noro is a bit hard to swallow! I should start a thread on Shmups just for the hell of it, trying to explain it to them :)
83 04-12-2007 09:32:41
Re: The transliteration thread (44 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)
Recap escribió:
Is it that you have seen "Mamonoro" anywhere? 'Cause I really can't understand where's the problem with "Mamo-Noro" besides the people's laziness to write hyphens these days...!
No, I mean the other way around. That is to say, I would only use the hyphen if I saw it written on an official site.
Recap escribió:
Of course. But you know, exceptions to a rule must be supported by some reason. And again, I fail to see the issue with hyphens for compound words.
The exception to the rule would be the hyphen in sama, san, kun, etc. The rule would be "no hyphens for compound words". As for the reason for this exception... actually I just came up with a pretty good one.
When Japanese people pronounce the sama, san, kun, etc. there is an audible pause between the name and the honorific, correct? So they say Mushihime sama, not Mushihimesama. But when they pronounce Mamonoro they say it as one word. That's why I would not like to use a hyphen.
Again, this is my current thinking. It's a very delicate issue and I might change my mind at any moment. After all, I just recently started thinking about it... But in any case I take everything you say into consideration.
Looks alright to me (though the full name seems to be "Rekishi Gunzou Presents Monoshiri Sengoku-Ou"). It's a different case, anyhow. You can consider "Sengoku Ou" as two separated words and write it so.
I know the full name is much longer, but on the sidebar I try to shorten long names to fit in a single line. These are temporary links to official pages anyway, so having the full correct title is not that important.
84 01-12-2007 06:39:31
Re: The transliteration thread (44 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)
Recap escribió:
"Any Japanese sites"? I know you know at this point that Japanese are totally careless and useless for romanization stuff, so what's the point? Anyhow, yeah. Not sure about which examples exactly, but Japanese do "transliterate" so sometimes. They even separate them into two different words -- "Sata Kore", etc. But as I was saying, do never trust Japanese for transliteration rules, especially in regard to morphology stuff. It's a good advice, believe me.
I meant official sites. So if I saw for example Mamo-Noro on the official site I would write Mamo-Noro, but if I didn't see anything I would be free to make up my own mind about it.
Recap escribió:
Believe it or not, it's exactly the same thing. The only reason to write "Mushihime-sama" with a hyphen is because it's a compound word. And the truth is, despite recent usages and whatnot, that putting a hyphen is the most "natural" way to write compound words. Do whatever you want but, for you own good, consolidate. Write "Mushihimesama" if you are going to write "Mamonoro". Not that any of them are "incorrect", anyways...
This is the point. None of them are incorrect, and I guess it would indeed be more consistent to either use the hyphen in both cases or in none, but I could also make a rule with exceptions in it. The san, sama, kun, chan, etc. could be the exceptions.
Perhaps I need to give myself some time to the idea of a hyphen in all compound words. I tend to be quite conservative with things like this, but, given time, if something makes sense, I tend to adjust my views accordingly. For example, just earlier today I was updating the sidebar on my site, and I came across this game:
http://www.gae.co.jp/game/monoshiri/sen … kutop.html
Which I transliterated as "Monoshiri Sengoku-Ou" because I remembered this discussion (I hope I didn't make some fat-ass mistake!)
So perhaps if I allow some more time for this to sink in I might eventually be able to write Mamo-Noro. (And good luck to me trying to explain this to any shmups fans who ask me the reason!)
Recap escribió:
Whatever. Nor English nor Japanese have "the # and x characters" actually. Indeed, when you're writing a # when you mean "sharp" or an x when you mean "cross", you're not using either, Japanese nor English. It's hard to me to explain this in English, you know... They are "language licenses", "borrowed forms" and, indeed, "writing jokes". Much like camelcase, or the lack of capital letters heading proper names, etc, etc, it's not acceptable for a proper, correct writing. That's why you'll find シャープ instead of # and クロス instead of x when you get to the game names written in Japanese, if you want a tangible argument.
It is true, I have seen this many times. On the spine of Wild Arms XF it says Wild Arms Cross Fire, Namco Cross Capcom, etc. etc.
I just don't know if I can post a review on my front page that says "Namco Cross Capcom"... I know it's a stupid argument, but I think it would look silly. Plus, I would dread making a url like http://insomnia.ac/reviews/playstation2 … osscapcom/ because if I changed my mind later on I'd be stuck with it.
Man, this stuff sucks. I wish I didn't have to worry about it and I could just review games.
Recap escribió:
Obviously. Even the official Western name is "Pochi and (= to) Nyaa". I'm going to destroy another of those transliteration myths for you, by the way. Correct transliteration for ...ッチ... is not "cch", but "tch". Think about it -- ッ is actually about "reinforcing the following sound", not about a mere "consonant duplicity". "Pocchi" is read "pok-chi", which is nothing like the original word's pronounciation. "Potchi", on the other hand...
Yeah, I am with you there. "tch" is definitely preferable to "cch".
85 29-11-2007 20:59:48
Re: The transliteration thread (44 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)
Recap escribió:
When you're transliterating into a Roman-based alphabet, you must follow its own rules, no matter what the original language does (especially when the writing codes have nothing to do each other). There are hundreds of examples of this very trend from Japanese authors of our days: Mamoru-kun ha Norowarete Shimatta! -> Mamo-Noro, Saturn Collection -> Sata-Kore, Winning Eleven -> Ui-Ire... "Noomiso Kone-Kone Puzzle" into "Noo-Kone Puzzle" is exactly the same. I don't know how the Japanese authors would like the romaji forms for those examples. Not that I care if I want to set a general rule, either. Compound words (especially if they're as arbitrary as this brand-new naming thingies) go with an in-between hyphen in my Roman-based language, much like a ☆ is never a conventional sign in my Roman-based language.
I see what you are saying. However, I do have a couple of objections. First off, have you seen any Japanese sites write "Mamo-Noro", "Sata-Kore" and "Ui-Ire"? In English I mean...
If not, I will prefer to not use a hyphen in these cases... I don't know man, Mamo-Noro seems very unnatural to me. It doesn't seem at all like the same thing as Mushihime-sama. I understand 100% why you would choose to make this rule universal on your website, but in this case I think I will make an exception to that rule on my website and go without the hyphen for compound titles where the developers themselves do not use a hyphen in their own transliterations...
Re: the star in Takoron:
Recap escribió:
But don't forget to transliterate it for now, though. As I told you, the cases when it's not actual part of the name are the minority.
Again here I see what you are saying, but it just seems very unnatural to me to write "Sharuuii Star Takoron". Just as I would never write Guilty Gear XX Sharp Reload or Namco Cross Capcom. I mean, yeah, that's how you pronounce the names, but both English and Japanese have the # and x characters, so why not just leave them as is? And tell people how to pronounce them in a parenthesis, if you have to...
A "chouonfu" is hiragana too. It's up to the user whether if using it or writing an "extra vowel".
I read up on this and found another example:
http://www.system16.com/hardware.php?id … age=9#1690
What do you think about this game? Pocchitto Nyaa? At least the "to" should be separate.
Recap escribió:
I agree to disagree there. For someone who does know the game name and just want to verify transliteration, or knowing release date, whatever, you're right. But what about those who indeed want the name of the games released in 1997, for instance? Release-date order can be very useful, I believe, but also entertaining. Try it out!
Keep in mind it's a full, single-paged list, anyway. You can always use the search tool of your browser ("street fighter", "nippon ichi", "neg-con"...). Not everybody can say that about their soft lists!
True enough. But both of us should really get databases up and running eventually and solve this issue once and for all, because the more content we keep adding to the sites the more essential a database becomes. Too bad I've no idea how to do it, and no time to learn!
86 27-11-2007 21:22:58
Re: The transliteration thread (44 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)
Recap escribió:
Seems this game modified its name a little bit at some point. Check this:
http://www.am-j.co.jp/newmachine/200609/002.html
"Noomiso Kone-Kone Puzzle Takoron".
The official site uses "Noo-Kone Puzzle Takoron" currently, which looks like an abbreviation of the former name (that's why I'm using the hyphen here; "Noo-Kone" is a compound word).
Interesting. To be honest, I am still not clear on the use of the hyphen. Can you give me some easier to understand examples of when it's proper to use it? The only ones I can think of are with "san" and "sama"...
Recap escribió:
Hard question, I'm afraid. If you're asking if you should keep the star as it is (that is, as a sign), then, quick answer -- never ever. That's not orthodox writing, after all, whichever the language we're talking about.
But if you're asking if you should transliterate it too (that is, "Sharuuii Star Takoron"), well, then, I don't know. Normally you should (Guilty Gear # Reload / -> Guilty Gear Sharp Reload Slash, Street Fighter II' -> Street Fighter II Dash...). The ☆ is much the same, but _sometimes_ it's not intended to be part of the actual name, so you must be careful.
Fair enough. In this case I'll go without the star.
Recap escribió:
Notice I wrote "Sharuuii". That ~ you have there is a "chouonfu", a "long-vowel mark", much like ー.
That's the first time I hear of this. And why do they not just use an extra vowel, since it's in hiragana?
Recap escribió:
Thanks. So your suggestion is...?
Well, ideally there should be an option to sort the games any way you'd like to: by publisher, date, genre, etc. But if you don't have a database in place then I think the most sensible option would be to list them alphabetically...
Recap escribió:
I think I'm missing something! Your point?
Well, using all-caps is one way to avoid the problem of whether to capitalize some letters in the title. But I think I now understand that this should almost never be done, so I guess it makes no difference.
87 27-11-2007 21:12:06
Re: Proper acknowledgement (20 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)
I kinda figured that out on SB but I didn't want to say anything in front of those morons. I was going to email you about it to ask for clarification, so it's good you mentioned it.
Recap escribió:
After checking some of your news posts at Insomnia, I'm finding out that you mention "Ruliweb" as source for the scans. Most likely you already know it and it's just the way you like to do it, but let me say that Ruliweb is never the original source. All of their mag scans are stolen from 2 Channel. I link Ruliweb only because it re-uploads the scans to its own hosting service and I can always be sure they won't be down anytime soon (aside of being easier to find), but believe me -- I hate it. They (its posters) rarely mention the original source, much like Jeux-France, Go Nintendo or many others. But hey, at least Western visitors of Ruliweb can't make any money for these bastards.
I had no idea. Sometimes I saw them quote 2ch as the source, but I just figured they had someone buy the latest magazines and just scanned them. I'll stop linking to them and when I have some time I'll go back and delete all the old links.
88 25-11-2007 19:13:04
Re: The transliteration thread (44 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)
So, I've gathered a bunch of questions for you, Recap...
First off, it seems to me you're mistaken with the titles of the Etrian Odyssey and Izuna games.
Your versions:
Sekaijuu no Meikyuu
Kouma Ryoufu Den Izuna
The Japanese Wikipedia versions:
Sekaiju no Meikyuu
http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/世界樹の迷宮
Gouma Reifu Den Izuna
http://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/降魔霊符伝イヅナ
Next, I'd like to ask you how you transliterate the title of that Takoron Naomi game. My version is No-Kone Puzzle Takoron (のーコネパズル たころん), but Wikipedia calls it Noumiso Konekone Puzzle Takoron... I know they are wrong, but I am not sure my version is 100% correct either.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octomania
http://www.compileheart.com/tako/ron.html
I am also not 100% sure about the Wii port. I've got it down as Sharuui~☆Takoron (しゃるうぃ～☆たころん). Should I keep the star or what?
http://www.compileheart.com/wii/takoron.html
Lastly, KOF Neowave. Is it Neowave, NeoWave or Neo Wave? The current North American champion prefers NeoWave, but what does he know? I see you got it down as two words, but I think I prefer one word... My main issue is with whether to capitalize the W...
On another note, your PS list is totally awesome, though the lack of an alphabetical listing makes finding specific games a bit hard. Not that I mind the extra effort -- just saying. Also, your idea of using all-caps for the English titles is a very smart one, I think. I might start doing the same on my frontpage...
89 23-11-2007 07:33:15
Re: Poison Pink: lo último de Flight Plan. (6 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)
Interview with Masami Watanabe, president of Flight-Plan, and as hardcore a gamer as they get.
With Summon Night we managed to create a world not seen before with a concept of cute characters and summons. As far as Poison Pink is concerned, the impetus was the idea to create a completely different, new fantasy world. This game's concept is to catch and collect demons in a dark fantasy world. The protagonists are three characters investigating a den of demons named Besek, which has suddenly appeared. The demons are awaiting the protagonists, who have embarked on their journey to rescue a princess who has been abducted to the demon lair. When defeating the demons, who attack one after the other, it is possible to capture and turn them into party members if special conditions are met. At a place known as Demon's Mansion, it is possible to dismantle demons and turn them into weapons. After freeing the people abucted by the demons, one can also enjoy a conversation with them at a safehouse. I think that adding system of catching and collecting [demons] to the fun of the simulation will definitely make players happy.
http://www.rpgfan.com/features/intervie … ndex1.html
Also reveals two new games: a second self-published one and a new PS2 Summon Night installment that will be an action RPG.
90 22-11-2007 23:02:06
Re: Senjou no Valkyria (PS3). (14 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)
Yeah, I didn't want to admit it to myself, but now that you mention it, it really doesn't look all that exciting...
91 20-11-2007 16:31:04
Re: Senjou no Valkyria (PS3). (14 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)
http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/game/doc … 19/val.htm
Includes downloadable 59 MB video detailing the game's system.
92 15-11-2007 00:16:53
Re: The transliteration thread (44 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)
Recap escribió:
To me, it's not a good approach, since in Japanese you indeed have "kyouryuu" _and_ "kyoryu", and they both sound quite differently.
Yeah, your thinking makes sense. The above reason is what convinces me to ignore URLs from now on. Thanks.
93 14-11-2007 22:51:33
Re: The transliteration thread (44 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)
Couple of questions for you Recap, when you have some time...
There's this MD game called Crying whose subtitle is giving me trouble. Full title: クライング 亜生命戦争. I know the last two kanji are "Sensou", but I am not sure about the first three. Emuasylum has it down as Crying: Asia Seimei Sensou.
Another thing I want to ask about is what to make of the URLs of official sites that are simply wrong. One recent example:
The game's title would normally be rendered in English as Kodai Ouja Kyouryuu King, but clearly the developer's web designer thinks differently. What should I do in such cases? It seems to me that I should go with their version, much in the same way as we choose to write Radirgy and Karous instead of Rajirugi and Karasu...
94 07-11-2007 16:16:00
Re: The transliteration thread (44 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)
Yeah, there's no space when you write it and no pause when you pronounce it. It's a compound word.
95 06-11-2007 16:04:42
Re: The transliteration thread (44 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)
I am not sure of the English word, literary it means "Doll Theatre". You know, when you have a guy (or several, I guess) who use dolls and ventriloquism to imitate a theatre play. Puppet-play, perhaps?
96 03-11-2007 02:29:17
Re: The transliteration thread (44 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)
lololol that is freaking awesome
Your transliteration is perfect, but note that in Greek it's one word: "Kouklotheatro".
97 03-11-2007 02:04:15
Re: Poison Pink: lo último de Flight Plan. (6 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)
Genre: Dark Fantasy Simulation RPG :)
98 12-10-2007 14:01:26
Re: Arcana Heart: nuevo juego de lucha en 2D. (58 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)
Recap escribió:
icycalm escribió:I've heard a lot of people say that they are unwilling to play this simply because of the designs... It's just too bad.
You can't blame them in this case, thoe!
No, I am certainly not blaming them. For years I couldn't get too much into Virtua Fighter because of the lame character designs. Only with 5 have I been able to put some time into it, because they've actually improved some of them to the point where I can even say I kinda like them.
Like I said, it's too bad Yuki chose the lolis. Perhaps it would have been smarter if they had gone with samurai or some shit.
On the other hand, it's not like we don't already have a lot of samurai-themed games. And Sengoku Basara is coming out soon... I mean how many 2D fighters do we have with little girls in them? (not counting doujin, of course)
99 12-10-2007 13:56:27
Re: The transliteration thread (44 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)
I guess that list you posted is a good start. I had no idea what these games were called in Chinese up to now. What I'll do is take it and try to find a couple of Chinese-speakers (preferably native) to go over it and suggest changes if necessary. I'll post here the results once they reply...
100 11-10-2007 04:03:18
Re: The transliteration thread (44 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)
I hear you on the Esprade thing. Same with Espgaluda. There's just no explaining to those people how silly it is what they are doing.
Recap escribió:
To sum it up, I'd use either "Donpachi", or "Don-Pachi", but _never_ "DonPachi".
Fair enough, Donpachi it is then.
Recap escribió:
Checking the title screen ( http://www.mameworld.net/maws/romset/ddp2 ) I'd say that that's not really the name for the Jap version.
Actually there are no title screens in that link, but check here:
http://www.system16.com/hardware.php?id … =3400#3400
Man, I have no idea which is which.
Also, related to the above, I have pretty much the same problem with all of IGS's games. I don't know where to find reliable transliterations from the original Chinese/Taiwanese/whatever titles.
http://insomnia.ac/archive/games/polygamemaster/
I asked Macaw to ask a friend of his who speaks Chinese, but it seems there are two ways to transcribe Chinese words? I am thinking that if you can't help me out with this I'll have to go with the English titles... Or else maybe send a PM to SAM on Shmups, who I think is from Taiwan...