17.651 Respuesta por Recap

(86 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)

Eboshidori escribió:

Some interlaced PS2 games should be originally 224 lines instead of 240, like, say, the ports of Psikyo games.

It's even worse, considering the PAL and NTSC resolutions: so, in many compilations, you have games with 224 lines that are stretched to 480 lines (PAL resolution of the PS2, 50 Hz) , and you have games with 240 lines stretched to 448 (NTSC resolution, 60 Hz).

Sure, but for games originally of 224 lines on NTSC machines (the ones that matter), it could serve. Anything's better than plain scaling.



I tried Mushi. It's badly scaled on the Y axis (240 to 448) as you know, but even on the X axis !!! When the backgrounds scroll, there are several places where the lines are suddenly divided...
It's small, but it's anoying. And of course the game is filtred.

I guess that you'd get the same issues with the soft patch?




I'm thinking indeed about many possibilities. Windows games at 320 x 240 design resolution but with forced 640 x 480 mode in full screen, for instance. There're lots of doujin games like that (some do keep the desktop rez, fortunately for us with 15 kHz cards, but very few).

If the game runs at 640x480 with a clean line doubling, there's no need to force it to 320x240. Just run the graphic card at 480i, and disable the interlacing on the TV.

If you use Windows XP, when you force the game at a lower resolution, it may be filtred, as everything is filtred by now (on Windows 2000, the defaut image viewer didn't filter the pictures when you saw them at different resolution, for example).

Just to clarify, for the games which just keep the desktop rez on full-screen mode, you don't force anything. They work flawlessly if you're at 320 x 240. For the games which get pixel-doubled on full-screen mode, I never knew how to force them for a 240p display, I'm afraid -- they auto-change to 480i.




There is no danger for the TV, the deinterlacing process doesn't modify frequency, timings and voltage amplitude of the signal. It's just a question of skipping some sync lines and the half-scanline of the regular interlaced signal.

Every old game systems that run at 240p use non standard signal, a video signal  with (deliberately) missing sync informations. That's the secret. :)

Yeah, I know. It's nice how they turned a by-product into a wonderful artform, though. But wasn't sure about forcing it with the service menu -- can't wait to check it out now.

Ir al foro: English talk

17.652 Respuesta por Recap

(3.908 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

Recap escribió:

Recettear (WIN):

Es lo último de Easy Game Station, autores de Ele-Paper Action ( http://egs-soft.info/product/elepaper/epa.html ). Un "simulador de tendero" con partes de acción a lo Zelda:

http://egs.cug.net/circle/recet/index.html

Aún sin fecha de lanzamiento. Gracias a Zepy.

Tres años después, parece que tendremos versión en inglés. Viene de manos de una nueva casa, se ve que con aspiraciones profesionales [ > ], y ya tiene 'demo':

https://i.imgur.com/ES06txE.jpeg

http://www.carpefulgur.com/recettear/

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.653 Respuesta por Recap

(86 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)

Eboshidori escribió:

First, you can only find it in numerical chassis (TVs from 1995 and after). In some TVs, it is explicitly indicated in some menus:

http://raster.effect.free.fr/15khz/480i … 8366_2.jpg

( other pictures at : http://raster.effect.free.fr/15khz/480i-240p/  )

This example is a 1995 Trinitron.

It's the TV I'm using currently. I just need to find "Interlace", right?




At the time I didn't go further, because I noticed that the "deinterlaced" picture looks awfull if the source was filtred (either bilinear or anti-flicker)...
If the game or the system doesn't allow you to display a clean picture, it's not worthy to try to display 240p. If You try to regain scalines from a game with 240 lines that have been scaled to 448 lines (the typical PS2 case) and filtred, you'll get nasty flickering on few lines, and shitty picture anyway.

Some interlaced PS2 games should be originally 224 lines instead of 240, like, say, the ports of Psikyo games. Have you tried Mushi or Ibara? They're supposedly 320 x 240 originally. I know they're all filtered, but many people are de-interlacing them with soft patches and whatnot and they seem to work to some degree.



But when you start from a nice source (an emulator set at 480i with perfect line doubling and no filters, displayed on your TV with soft15khz), it gives you perfect results ! (and absolutly no lag)

I'm thinking indeed about many possibilities. Windows games at 320 x 240 design resolution but with forced 640 x 480 mode in full screen, for instance. There're lots of doujin games like that (some do keep the desktop rez, fortunately for us with 15 kHz cards, but very few).

And what about Capcom's DC games like Capcom vs SNK 2 or Marvel vs Capcom 2? You must have tested that!

If this somehow works (can't you harm the TV?) you've made my day.

Ir al foro: English talk

17.654 Respuesta por Recap

(86 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)

Eboshidori escribió:

I tried to take the best and sharpest pictures, tried several way to resize them, but at the end, it's the same problem: there aren't enough pixel to show enough details.

To take sharper pictures of the CRT screen, remember it's a question of shutter speed and underexposure. Try to find the good set-up to, to have low levels, just enough to be able to recover them.

I'm still to check the camera's settings and try it out properly according to your instructions, but thanks. Will do it soon.





So, you display a 448x448 picture in a 640x480 windows. You just have to change the horizontal size in the chassis of your CRT, a perfect stretch with no loss of quality (thanx to the flexibility of the raster).

Stretching 448 lines out of 640 for a 4 : 3 display sounds like a bit too much, though, even for the best tubes out there. I'm interested in the interlace disabling without scan converter you mention though. Which TVs have it or how do you find it on the service menus?

Ir al foro: English talk

17.655 Respuesta por Recap

(164 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

Capcom se lanza al fin a la edición de sus clásicos de recreativa para VCA. Empiezan por el principio, eso sí:

http://g-bri.com/modules/news/?p=6559

http://www.capcom-onlinegames.jp/news/16.html

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.656 Respuesta por Recap

(40 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

"Akai Katana" ("La Espada Roja"). Previsto para Agosto, con el primer 'test' público el 23 de Julio en el Hey de Akihabara:

http://cave-game.cocolog-nifty.com/photos/uncategorized/2010/07/16/_.jpg

http://www.cave.co.jp/gameonline/akaikatana/

(botón verde para el vídeo)


http://cave-game.cocolog-nifty.com/blog … -9158.html


Enlaces: Game Nyarth 1.0.

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.657 Respuesta por Recap

(6 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

http://www.4gamer.net/games/113/G011367/20100716012/

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.658 Respuesta por Recap

(86 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)

Eboshidori escribió:

BlazBlue is 1280x768. WXGA is 1366x768.

Seems 1280 x 768 is also 'WXGA':

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Vecto … dards2.svg

So they did use a known standard at least. Still stupid enough given that both, Vewlix' monitors and HD-ready TVs are 1360 x 768.



KOF is "pure" 2D. If you could set the game at 768p, that would mean that the backgrounds are cropped when you see them at 720p. But no, there do not exist extra pixels beyond 720p.

So you have already confirmed that? The shit's getting dumber and dumber. Do you know what's the default setting for the arcade version assuming it's on a Vewlix cab? Stretch to 768 lines for a full-screen display or native 720 for two black borders?



I'm sure there'll be an option to remove the filter (at least for home versions), but in the end, same issue as in XII -- you can't play the game and please your eyes at the same time.

I don't think so. For KOF XII, since the sprite have an exactly 200% upscaling (round number, constant pixel size), they considered the option of disabling the filters, but for KOF XIII, if you display the sprites without filtring them, they will look fuckin ugly with enormous jaggies. They will look uglier than those unfiltred in KOF XII.

Not that it seems to be something they'll be concerned about, if you ask me.





The best I can reach by now is that:

http://raster.effect.free.fr/tv/Photos_ … na_02f.jpg


Note that this picture is taken from a low curvature Trinitron (no cheating, it's a real old 29" low-res tube, not a computer one! :P ), from 3m from the screen. The curvature seems very low at this distance, and the focus of the picture is good even for corners.

Each time I try to go under that, the picture shows lots of artifacts ([>] like this...).
I can reduce that with a little bit of horizontal blurr, but anyway, the picture will always loose the smallest details of the surface of the CRT screen (i.e. the phosphore layout).

Damn, do you realise it ? All those fuckin "High Resolution crystal clear" screens of today can't show the magnificence of a low-res picture tube at one time... :P :P :P

The best way is to provide full shots with a necessary lack of phoshore layout (something that seems too much  "clean" to you), and propose shots of small parts of the action. Something that can shows the greatness of pixel art displayed by CRT, like [>] this or [>] this, maybe...

I guess I can't have everything. The bigger the rez, the more accurate the screenshots get, no wonder, but serves nothing if you need to downscale them in order to display it on your monitor. For game analysis, you need to show full screenshots, think about it. And I'm not disatisfied with the results I got, as I told you. Once I get them less blurry, that is.

Ir al foro: English talk

17.659 Respuesta por Recap

(2.044 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

Natsugee Museum, en Tokyo:

http://www.spacemul.net/index.php#mise_ … me|65|0-9|

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.660 Respuesta por Recap

(13 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnwEnk5uBLY&fmt=22

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2LT5YYYGKk&fmt=22

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1wWdvP75aa0&fmt=22


Vía Koohatsu, GN 1.0.

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.661 Respuesta por Recap

(79 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

El 'opening': http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NXc9_4-kqhY

...y, si queréis destripároslo antes incluso de jugarlo, el 'final boss': http://h.pic.to/17b5ps | http://u.pic.to/1406n7



Y desde el sitio oficial: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Juhy_pz5 … r_embedded



Enlaces: http://gamenyarth.blog67.fc2.com/

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.662 Respuesta por Recap

(3.908 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

Legend of Iya (WIN)

Lleva las de convertirse en el eterno prototipo y la dinámica da miedito, pero le vamos dedicando un mensaje:

https://i.imgur.com/3mTDNCm.png

http://www.pixelprospector.com/indev/20 … nd-of-iya/

http://pixeljoint.com/pixelart/18864.htm

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.663 Respuesta por Recap

(94 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

Quizás casi nadie habla de él por lo feo que es, pero el caso es que esta semana el PSN recibe uno de los pocos juegos de disparo tradicionales que ha visto PS3, vía Spike. Se llama 'Astro Tripper':

http://japan.gamespot.com/i/product/10458827/b008.jpg

http://japan.gamespot.com/ps3/news/stor … 570,00.htm

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.664 Respuesta por Recap

(65 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2W08x86nFA&fmt=22

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.665 Respuesta por Recap

(79 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

Detallado avance de cuatro páginas en Dengeki Online a tres días de su salida oficial:

http://news.dengeki.com/elem/000/000/279/279146/c20100710_kof13b_045_cs1w1_640x360.jpg

http://news.dengeki.com/elem/000/000/278/278975/

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.666 Respuesta por Recap

(14 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

http://blog.dengeki.com/dps/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/100709_blog2_05.jpg

http://blog.dengeki.com/dps/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/100709_blog2_07.jpg

http://dps.dengeki.com/2010/07/09/p20361/

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.667 Respuesta por Recap

(3.908 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

Vampire Rage (XB360, descargable por 80 MSP)

http://download.xbox.com/content/xna/assets/5855058A_World/screen3_Web.jpg

http://marketplace.xbox.com/en-US/games … 025855058a

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vTsmPHdEZJ8

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.668 Respuesta por Recap

(2 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QeioNKe-b9w

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.669 Tema creado por Recap

(11 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

Un álbum de manos de INH y Team Entertainment dedicado a las series Kuhga y Darwin, a punto de salir:

http://ec3.images-amazon.com/images/I/51qyPC1P9XL._SS500_.jpg


http://www.team-e.co.jp/sp/data_east/

(Botón 'PV' para el vídeo.)

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.670 Respuesta por Recap

(86 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)

By chance, do you have any Technopolis mag where Tamashii no Mon is featured or advertised? I'm desperately looking for the cover art at decent resolution.

Pasting here the promised PC88 Dios screenshot at its native res with 15 kHz video hardware. This is how the game looked like originally on the PC88:

http://i30.tinypic.com/2v8k9oy.jpg

Notice, despite the blurry pic (I was out of luck this time), that it has little to do with what you get with standard PC video hardware. Graphics look almost like a 16-bit console game.

Ir al foro: English talk

17.671 Respuesta por Recap

(86 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)

It's quite unique, at least. Needs some corrections once I get the time to check the Japanese interweb. For instance, I've learned that the 640 x 400 mode of these is not 31 kHz, but 24 kHz. That technically is not 'high resolution', but 'extended resolution', as some put it. But pretty much it's all like I pictured.


Macaw escribió:

The partial scanlines thing is something I have always wondered about in PC98 games. Do you know if it provided any extra performance on games? Its insane that stuff such as Vain Dream 2 and Digan would have the character sprites designed properly in high res, then apply the scanline technique to the backgrounds. It would have been frustrating trying to design the backgrounds to properly fit the scale of the sprites, and the background tiles really aren't that complex so why not just design those properly for high res too.

I disagree. The more the resolution, the more the details needed. Simple tiles would get complex unless you go with 'empty-style' backgrounds and 'flat' colors. Scanline effects just helped to avoid this style, which generally has little to do with the 8-bit style they were trying to evolve. And let's not forget about RAM and even CPU limitations -- in this sense, it indeed did provide 'extra performance' on games.



Anyway, in the case of most PC88 stuff and some of the 98 stuff, Its incredibly bizarre that they had to design stuff in 640x200, knowing that the height will be doubled.

Lets just look at that 640x200 Dios shot you have there, so those are what the original graphic elements look like once designed. So in the case of Dios for example they wanted a realistic proportions look on the characters, yet had to originally design them to be quite wide. It would have been hard to know what a game would end up looking like if your designing stuff originally in a different scale. Companies designing these games at the time would have had to do constant double width mock ups to see what stuff is looking like, or perhaps even design stuff in the double length initially and then cut it back down to half.

I hardly believe that they used square pixels-based video hardware in the early years to design game graphics. They most likely used hardware capable of the same video modes as the target platforms -- remember that work stations and PCs weren't always like they are today and that there was a era where the pixels' aspect ratio was indeed a quite changeable thing thanks to CRT technology.

Ir al foro: English talk

17.672 Respuesta por Recap

(86 respuestas, enviadas el English talk)

Moving this here from the development subforum since I guess it will be of interest for non-contributors too:

Macaw escribió:

Just messing around here a bit. These are some direct screen captures using the emulator. They end up as 640x400, and I've taken one both with and without m88's scanline option. I still have no idea how stuff really should look on a real pc88, so I'll let you analyze it a bit. I'll mess around with m88's options more over time.

In the low res screenshots thread you also mention how some games such as Tritorn 2 were designed with fake scanlines. Are you sure you weren't just fooled by the m88 scanline option? In the first shot of Dios here with the m88 scanline option off you can see that there are no lines at all, though perhaps Dios wasn't designed with fake scanlines?
Perhaps I've completely misunderstood you in the first place, I still don't know much of the technicalities in this area but would appreciate learning more.

http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/1986/dios1.png http://img267.imageshack.us/img267/707/dios2.png

Old-computer screenshots is indeed quite a tricky subject. Most of them from 1983 onwards--PC88 included--supported both, 15 kHz (low res) and 31 kHz (hi res) modes. For PC88 and PC98, almost always you'd find either, 640 x 200 or 640 x 400 (they were actually 640 x 240 and 640 x 480 once the monitors' benchmarks were set as I explained earlier, but let's just leave that apart for now). PC88's hi-res mode was pretty limited color-wise, so we must assume most games used 640 x 200. So an actual frame-buffer screen from your game should be like this:

https://i.imgur.com/RhpK39e.png

By that (which I guess it's the first PC88 screen ever at its original resolution [laughs]), you can understand why the emulator--conceived, sadly, only for stardard PC video cards--automatically line-doubles the image (1st screen in your post) -- the aspect ratio through a standard PC is way too distorted. The game, you know, despite the resolution, had a 4 : 3 aspect ratio (not really 4 : 3 if we count the excluded borders, but close enough). It could be possible--I never had a PC88--that the game was line-doubled on the original frame-buffer for a 'fake' hi-res display so that the emulator is actually mimicking that behaviour, but given that there also existed 15 kHz-only PC88 monitors, I don't find that too plausible. That's also the reason for a universal scanlines simulation feature on the emulator (your 2nd screen) -- it's the most natural way to replicate the original low-res display on hi-res video hardware (therefore rendering the line-double method quite useless), though we've already explained that the final result here--no matter the type of monitor you're using--lacks the beauty of actual 'scanlines' for several reasons (hence the point I've been claiming for years of never using a standard PC for proper emulaton, if you're really into that).

Now PC98 is a bit different. It was especially designed for hi-res (most of its monitors indeed couldn't do 15 kHz) and we must assume that most games were rendered at 640 x 400. This was a problem for simultaneous PC88/PC98 releases or PC88 - PC98 ports -- you now needed to double the original lines for a hi-res display, and that's what many devs did:

http://fullmotionvideo.free.fr/screen/m/xak1.png
PC98 Xak

https://i.imgur.com/YJTd985.gif
PC98 Fray

(They didn't need any excuse though -- many original PC98 games were also designed at half the display resolution, saving RAM demands and well, effort.)

Fortunately others decided against this awful method and invented the scanlines simulation -- instead of drawing the same line twice, even lines would be black lines. That PC98 Tritorn II screenshot you mention, to answer your question, doesn't have scanlines added by the emulator; the game was rendered exactly like that. You can check these other examples for more color:

http://fullmotionvideo.free.fr/screen/p/lesser1.png
PC98 Lessern Mern

http://fullmotionvideo.free.fr/screen/g/vd21.png
PC98 Vain Dream II


Notice the scanlines are applied only on the action area or the background -- there's no way an emulator could do that. Of course they went even further and invented different patterns which, applied on the line-doubled picture, would alleviate the issues of design - display discrepancies:

http://fullmotionvideo.free.fr/screen/a/digan%201.png
PC98 Digan no Maseki

So that's why you won't find (my guess) a scanlines simulation feature on any PC98 emulator.

This pretty much covers, not just your questions, but the whole core of what was going to be part 2 of the Scanlines -- Ab Initio article, so it's now done for anyone's interested. Thank Macaw. The only remaining thing would be illustrating with actual photographs the wonders of 15-kHz RGB CRTs to let everybody see what they've missed, and that will come with the new Site's content itself. So yeah.



Edit: Grammar bits.

Ir al foro: English talk

17.673 Tema creado por Recap

(2 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

Anunciado para el DS-I Ware estadounidense:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qZ0Bx8w5 … r_embedded

Como conversión de: http://www.gameloft.com.ec/juegos-celul … -darkness/

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.674 Respuesta por Recap

(79 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

Paquete con digitalizaciones a gran resolución del último avance de KOF XIII en Arcadia Magazine junto a la publicidad interior:

http://www.mediafire.com/?t5rmnuzmiiw

(http://cyberfanatix.com/forums/index.ph … l#msg27543)


La Technical Reference cuenta ya con varios capítulos, accesibles desde aquí:

Vía http://game.snkplaymore.co.jp/official/ … countdown/

...mientras la útlima entrada del 'blog' de desarrollo está dedicada al equipo de Kim:

http://game.snkplaymore.co.jp/official/ … st_19.html

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos

17.675 Respuesta por Recap

(1 respuestas, enviadas el Hablemos de juegos)

http://www.famitsu.com/image/9419/s212_CY2BH71QgxK45SA77HQxQbqEG8g8Ao62.jpg

http://www.famitsu.com/game/coming/1236662_1407.html

Ir al foro: Hablemos de juegos